Together Digital Power Lounge, Women in Digital with Power to Share
Digital is a demanding and competitive field. And women are still grossly underpaid & underrepresented. But we are not powerless; we have each other. Together Digital Power Lounge is your place to hear authentic conversations from women in digital who have power to share. Listen and learn from our amazing guests along with host Amy Vaughan, Owner and Chief Empowerment Officer of Together Digital. Together Digital is a diverse and collaborative community of women who work in digital who choose to share their knowledge, power, and connections. To learn more, visit www.togetherindigital.com.
Together Digital Power Lounge, Women in Digital with Power to Share
Sales or Marketing? Which Comes First
Are you striving to determine whether sales or marketing should take precedence in your business strategy? In today’s episode, Amy Vaughn engages with Katie Nelson, Founder and CEO of Sales UpRising. With thirty years of sales experience and over $150 million in products and services sold, Katie is on a mission to help businesses overcome the statistic that 90% fail to meet their sales goals. Her expertise has transformed hundreds of entrepreneurial ventures from mere ideas into thriving, profitable enterprises.
Katie discusses her approach to prioritizing sales and cash flow as the foundation for business success, while effectively aligning marketing strategies to support growth. Through workshops, mastermind courses, and personalized training, she empowers business owners with strategies that have built multi-million-dollar firms.
Join Amy and Katie as they explore practical strategies for balancing sales efforts with building a strong brand. Katie’s insights offer actionable advice to enhance your business strategies and drive sustainable growth, providing a fresh perspective on the dynamic between sales and marketing.
Chapters:
00:00 - Introduction
02:00 - "Sales vs. Marketing Debate with Katie"
08:21 - "Sales Uprising: Empowering Entrepreneurs"
10:41 - Building Business Without Algorithms
19:39 - "Uncover Insights Through Experience"
21:12 - "Enhance Revenue Through Team Collaboration"
28:02 - "Entrepreneurship: Runway and Expenses"
34:03 - "Focus on Cash, Not Content"
41:31 - "Talking to Products via AI"
43:07 - Prioritize Sales Over Creativity
48:57 - Passion for Community Impact
55:41 - "Offer and Market Focus"
01:00:59 - "Business Insights with Katie"
01:02:06 - Outro
Key Takeaways:
Embracing Sales as a Creative Venture
Sales First, Then Marketing
Every Conversation is a Sales Opportunity
Understanding Your Market
Cash Flow is the Lifeline
Transformative Power of Focused Selling
Collaboration Over Competition
Ask the Tough Questions
Quotes:
"Sales are conversations that build relationships and foster understanding."- Amy Vaughn
"Every conversation connects and transforms. Sales are the lifeblood of your business."- Katie Nelson
Connect with Katie Nelson
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/thesalescatalyst/
Website: https://www.salesuprising.com/
Connect with the host Amy Vaughan:
LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/amypvaughan
Podcast: https://www.togetherindigital.com/podcast/
Learn more about Together Digital and consider joining the movement by visiting https://togetherindigital.com
Hello everyone and welcome to our weekly Power Lounge. This is your place to hear authentic conversations from those who have power to share. My name is Amy Vaughn and I am the owner and chief empowerment officer of Together Digital, a diverse and collaborative community of women who choose to share their knowledge, power and connections. You can join the movement at togetherindigitalcom and today I am absolutely delighted to welcome Katie Nelson, a powerhouse sales leader who has transformed the way businesses approach revenue generation. As the founder and CEO of Sales Uprising, katie has spent over three decades mastering the art and science of sales, personally closing more than $150 million in products and services through her remarkable career. Way to go, katie.
Speaker 1:She is on a mission to change the troubling statistic that 90% of businesses fail to reach their sales goals. As a three-time business owner herself, she brings a unique perspective to our ongoing debate. In a chicken or egg scenario of business growth, which comes first sales or marketing? With her signature approach that brings fun back into sales, katie helps entrepreneurs transform their ideas into thriving, profit-generating businesses. Her expertise in creating workshops, mastermind courses and business retreats has equipped hundreds of business owners with the tools that they need to succeed in an increasingly competitive world. Today we're going to explore why Katie believes cash flow is your business's oxygen and how every business action can ultimately become a sales conversation. So, whether you're leading a marketing team, running your own business or looking to strengthen your strategy, katie's insights will help you rethink the relationship between marketing efforts and sales results. So everyone, please give a round of applause, yay, and welcome Katie to the Power Lounge. We're happy to have you here.
Speaker 2:Thank you, Amy. I couldn't be happier to be here.
Speaker 1:Fantastic. Yes, we are a common connection from our fantastic Molly Rowland, who's a member and our podcast team leader and producer and sponsor. We love, love, love, molly. So again, whenever it's like good people connecting good people, it's just going to be a good thing. And you know sales and marketing. You know our organization. We lead more, we lead God. It's so Friday already lean more towards marketing and we shy away from the sales. It's scary making the ask and doing the thing. But before we dive into that main topic that I know a lot of our members are ready to hear about, could you share a little bit about your career journey with our listeners? What led you to become a sales expert and eventually finding Sales Uprising after three decades in the field, which I don't think that's right. That can't be possible.
Speaker 2:Looking at you. Thanks, I'll take it, although I will tell you a secret underneath all of this purple hair is a full head of gray. So how I got into sales, I think started at the dinner table when I was eight. I know that sounds crazy, but both of my parents own their own business in the house that I grew up in and it was forever a struggle or a worry that business was going to go somewhere else or payroll wasn't going to be able to be made or whatever. You know all hashtag, all the struggles of business ownership, and I think somewhere in my head you know I was an energetic eight year old kid People liked me I would sell campfire candy door to door.
Speaker 2:So I just kind of thought you know what these people need? They just need someone who loves their stuff and sells it for them. I mean, it was super simple. I think is kind of the thought that got stuck in my head and I took that and ran with it as soon as I was of legal age to go work. I worked in a call center selling stuff part-time to earn movie money.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I did that for a hot minute, worst six weeks of my life, but good, good education.
Speaker 2:I loved it. It was amazing. What did you sell? I sold book clubs. I sold coffee, gevalia Coffee, which is still around.
Speaker 1:I sold Gevalia.
Speaker 2:Coffee subscriptions. I sold the very first Retinol, a face cream, over the phone, nice.
Speaker 1:That's not so bad. I sold windows. Windows, that's not fun.
Speaker 2:So I was 15 and a half and they tried to get me to sell credit card insurance programs which, let's be clear, when you work in a call center, comes with this huge script If yes, then this, If no, then this right. And you just kind of memorize it and then you put your own sauce on it if you will. And when they handed me the script and I read through it, I'm like, look, I don't qualify for these programs. I don't know what insurance is. I can read all of this and understand the language, but nobody is going to buy this from a sounding me sounding person. So I think that's how I ended up selling, you know, golden books, book clubs to stay at home, moms.
Speaker 1:Oh, that, that might not be. I might've been a little bit better at that than windows. It was just like the scripting and the over, like for you to station whatever the word there would be, like trying to do this. That was, that was. That was the hard part for me.
Speaker 2:Oh I, I found so much, I find that so interesting. I found that part to be the best part, because somebody had already collated all of this amazing data to say if this is someone's objection, this is the information that they're looking for. So I never really had to think about it. So for me, the script was literally just a script, just like it was in drama, right? So you've got your lines, but every single one of us gets to bring us to any part that we're playing, you know, and so I guess I kind of I enjoyed that part.
Speaker 1:This is your zone of genius for sure, maybe not so much mine. And then I'm kind of curious too, like founding and creating, like your own business with Sales Uprising. What was that journey like and about?
Speaker 2:That journey was like climbing up a mountain and then falling down a mountain and then deciding to climb up a mountain again. So I became an entrepreneur the first time, on accident, and what I mean by that is I didn't give too much thought to it. I was in my early 30s and a mentor of mine in professional services and staffing said hey, I want to start my own business and do you want to join me? And of course he said it in a way that made it impossible to say no and I was like, of course, but I didn't think of myself as a business owner because I was just doing the same job that I had always done, because when you're starting a business, the money in the door is the most important and needed thing. So I didn't really think of myself as a business owner. That business ended up sadly never getting off the runway, because now we had made six figures in 12 months. It was beautiful. We just didn't have enough runway for what the market could bear at that time, with sequestration and the continuing resolution. Some people may find that to be applicable today, unfortunately, because that was years ago. And then that business kind of morphed into the next business with a different owner and we.
Speaker 2:I did generate a $6 million run rate in under two and a half years and grew that business before sales uprising became a thing for me. Uh, before I realized like my true passion is teaching. I spent so much of my time teaching these program managers how to sell to their government front facing people, people who I had never seen, um, for the betterment of the business that I just much of my time teaching these program managers how to sell to their government front facing people people who I had never seen, for the betterment of the business, that I just realized I maybe had a talent for it and that that's what I really wanted to do. I wanted to help the moms and dads around the dinner table with their kids who were stressed out about their business, and teach them how to sell and grow their business that way.
Speaker 1:I love it. Bringing it back to the eight-year-old you, I feel like sometimes that's the way you've made it. We measure success in so many weird ways in our world and society, and for me it was like that moment when I was like, oh my gosh, I just made my eight-year-old self so happy. I'm doing the kind of work that me, as a child, before the rest of the world got to me like, would have loved to know that that's where we ended up and that's what we were doing.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, I love that Love it, love it.
Speaker 2:I, I sales uprising man. I want everybody to have one. So you know I get a lot of um interesting questions about the name of sales uprising. So you can close your eyes business owner in Main Street or behind their computers, like throwing up there. And this is for you too, amy. I heard you to say phooey on it. I'm just going to go sell Because, at the end of the day, if that is the one thing that you did, if you could battle and have an uprising against all of your mind demons about sales, your business and therefore your life and your customers' lives would be better. So that's where that comes from.
Speaker 1:I love it, yes, cause you're right. I mean, I think all us entrepreneurs could have a better relationship with sales, and women in particular. I think it is something where we struggle, right Cause we're not socially conditioned to promote ourselves or it's not seen as something that's attractive in women if they do that in professional societies in some circles. So, yeah, I can totally understand why some people hold back on it, but you're right, it is the lifeblood of everything. Like you say, it's the oxygen to your business, which we'll get to more soon, but yeah, without it there's no money coming in. So let's kind of get to that topic a little bit, about how we're talking about, whether it's cash or clicks, sales or marketing. First, where do you? I mean, we can't even know. But where are you standing on this debate and what experiences have shaped your perspective on this?
Speaker 2:Oh, you'll have to remind me of the second part, the heftier part, of the question. With that being said, what I would say is there is no one size fits all when it comes to business.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2:So, if you're a product-based business, clicks might be the thing. So a bigger marketing presence is going to be something that you're going to want to have created. If you are a service-based business, I would tell you sales is going to be the thing. Service-based businesses are much more dependent upon relationship. So, if you think about you know, there was a lovely woman in the Together Digital community that commented and she creates genealogy like, right, wendy Legacy boxes, right? So in an effort for someone to know my family, like I want to know who they are. So she has to spend much more time marketing ultimately, but the sell has to do with her relationship with the human Bots.
Speaker 2:Don't buy. If they did, I'm sure algorithms would be in a. They'd be even better. We would love them instead of hate them, but that's just not. I haven't outsourced the buying of my life to a bot at the moment. So sales is really the thing and I would tell you you can sell without a website. You know, when you're first starting your business, after you get your tax ID number and you set up your bank accounts and maybe you have some thoughts on your logo or your tagline or all of these things you don't really need to do a whole lot with it. You need to figure out what you want to deliver to your customer, see if it's sellable, and then you can grow everything from there. You can have the most beautiful idea of who you are as a business, what your business is called, your taglines, your fonts, your branding like the sexiest branding and you know all the people that create that, right, yeah, and if it's an idea that no one will buy, it doesn't mean anything.
Speaker 1:Oh, I think you just made their heads all of our members and listeners' heads explode.
Speaker 2:You can sell it on a website. What Katie sell it on a website. Girl. Look you know what? Oh my gosh, I'm going to. I'll be right back. I have to go grab something, okay.
Speaker 1:Oh my goodness, I know seriously listeners. Your heads are like wait what Spinning. But Katie, she's going to make it make sense.
Speaker 2:So I had to go get my Google profile re-verified. This happened to anybody lately, right? So I put up all of the things for all of my business and I found this hilarious old piece of marketing you guys see it, Yep.
Speaker 1:So for those that are listening to the podcast, it's just a postcard that says sales uprising. Maximizing relationships, drive results.
Speaker 2:Yep Drive revenue Revenue.
Speaker 1:Sorry.
Speaker 2:It was cut off and this literally was a stat. This was a literally static landing page with like my name and like call me and my phone number for three years Amazing.
Speaker 1:I didn't know anything, I won't attempt to learn.
Speaker 2:I'm not one of those and call me and my phone number. For three years in the business, I didn't know anything. I won't attempt to learn. I'm not one of those entrepreneurs who's like well, I need to go learn how to do a website. No, because that makes me a website designer.
Speaker 2:And I know nothing about that and it's going to take me so long, oh, absolutely so expensive if I do it that way. But I figured I would have a friend help me get this up and it would just stay there and I would go sell my fanny off until I could afford someone to fix that. Yeah, like to do something better, gotta start somewhere.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and the beautiful part about that is that through those sales, I understood my client better. So for everybody on here who is in marketing and branding, what my sales function brought me was understanding my niche better, being able to talk in a way that they could hear me right, versus spending all of this upfront cash on what I thought would be the thing, to find out it's not the thing and then feel like I have to redo it six months later, another six months later and then another year later.
Speaker 1:So sales first, Sales first. Yeah, MVP it right, that makes so much sense. And so I was the second half of the question and you kind of got into a little bit. But I don't know if you want to add more color to it, but how your experience have sort of shaped this perspective for you.
Speaker 2:I don't, I don't know any other way. Yeah, right, like.
Speaker 1:I'm not the marketing person Right.
Speaker 2:As a 30 year boots on the ground salesperson, I found marketing annoying because marketing is the prettiest of the thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Like marketing is the lipstick? It's not. It's not the grimy gritty like uh, to throw it back to my parents. You know they were in fencing and machinery, so it's not the dirt under your nails, it's not the fast orange that you're like using to scrub your, and that's what the sales function is, outside of delivery, right so on the front end of a business. And so I always was like why are you asking me about? Why are you asking me about this? Go create whatever one slick you need to.
Speaker 2:Please note I've never used a one pager to sell anything, ever. Right? So for me it was all like acting. If I have pieces of paper that have my name and my company and my capability statement on it, that just makes me look bigger than I am, which maybe some people are going to buy me for that. But if I took a straw poll of my clients over 30 years, I think maybe 2% of them would say yeah, katie, I purchased from you because you guys were the biggest name in the biz, or you were big enough or you had the right marketing anything.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, it makes a lot of sense too when you think about it. I just wrote down, as you were speaking there branding and marketing sell, but they aren't sales. They aren't guaranteed sales, and it is. It is the pretty thing, it is the shiny object that we all love and appreciate and want to spend time on. But you're right, at the end of the day, it is the relationship, it's the sales that have to actually make, which is what makes the money move. So then, as you kind of grow and build, then yeah, then marketing and branding can kind of come into play as you kind of grow and build then yeah, then marketing and branding can kind of come into play.
Speaker 2:But it is a bit of a mind warp. I was going to say so. You know that I'm sorry for jumping in, but here's the thing. You know. For all all of you out there who have ever heard, I'd really like to know what ROI I'm going to get out of my branding or marketing.
Speaker 2:Sorry for the noise, but really like, what a horrible question. Nobody loves that, and there's actually an answer to that. If the buyer has done their due diligence, you will get more ROI. If you can tell me cleanly and clearly who your target market is, yeah Right, so fantastic. I love that you're asking this question. What kind of ROI are you currently getting? What you know? What is your current sales funnel look like? Why do you think that your current marketing is failing you? And all of them could say it's because of whoever I'm using, and you and I both know that is never true. It's really not. It has to do with the business owner not being able to clearly articulate who they serve, the benefits of why someone would work with them or even their packages.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, yes, exactly, I feel that. Feel that All right Live listening audience. I know Danelle already jumped in to say, hey, your energy is amazing. She builds websites, by the way, if you need a website, katie.
Speaker 2:Well, danelle, go look, you can tell me. I'm sure the answer is yes. It will always be yes.
Speaker 1:She's a member out in Denver. But yes, live listening audience, please feel free to jump in and ask questions if you have them. We'd love to hear from you all. We're so glad that you're here listening with us live today. All right, so you've sold over $150 million in products and services, so, yeah, you clearly know what you're doing and what you're talking about. We're not going to doubt that. What is the biggest misconception you see among businesses about the relationship between marketing and sales? I think we've kind of tiptoed into this a little bit, but let's kind of keep going on that some more. It's your fault.
Speaker 2:No, it's your fault. No, it's your fault.
Speaker 1:Kids, siblings.
Speaker 2:Right, there's those amazing memes or Gifs or gifs or whatever they are online of like people pointing their finger at marketing and people pointing their finger back at sales, and I think for any of us who've ever worked in a corporate environment, you can fall down that rabbit hole so easily and it's the saddest thing on earth because, like, who are you trying to fool? Keep the thing the thing. Yeah, if marketing can say we have a thousand more followers than we did last month, marketing is doing its job. Right, if sales can say we hit the goal or we're over the goal, they're doing their job. So, instead of making it this arm wrestling match, the most beautiful thing is when we can come together and work together. Marketing and sales are literally the same thing to some extent, right. They're just like think of a quarter. One's a heads and one's a tails. They focus in two different directions of the same thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, I absolutely agree. And I also feel like when you can kind of cease that infighting and encourage collaboration between sales and marketing, then, yeah, guess what, it's not just a win-win for, like you, your team, it's a win for the whole company.
Speaker 2:Preach it, sister, like yes, all day, every day. One of the things I've never been able to do, or never had the opportunity to do, when I ran a bigger team, was be like hey, marketing, come hang out with me for a day.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Like in just a true sales role, not as the vice president or anything like that, just me as a business development executive or salesperson or account executive or client delivery executive Lots of words for sales chick but just come and hang out with me for a day so that you can see what it looks like to actually dive into. You're asking me questions that I may not be able to answer, but if you could hear the conversation, you would know your answers. You'd be able to fill out the Mad Lib, and what I mean by that is I could have 10 juicy, sexy, revenue generating conversations in a day. But if a marketing person ever said what's the one reason why people buy from you, I would never be able to answer that question Interesting Other than we're awesome at what we do, and I communicated that to them and so they said, yes, but a marketing person can't put that into language.
Speaker 2:That is going to give you more market share. So having your marketing people go out with your salespeople, having your salespeople hang out with your marketing people and see the work that they have to put in to create sexy, juicy content that is clickbaitable in today's world, I think it would go a long way towards everybody coming together and being like oh my gosh, I love you. I could never do that. I have no idea.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, exactly, I think it's like a kind of match made in heaven when you can find amicable ways to work, and I do think that oftentimes it's.
Speaker 1:You know, I guess I went like the marketing, like you said, is that kind of exterior wrapper, it's the thing that might draw somebody in, but then the sales is what needs to like, close the deal, close the lead, and the relationship needs to be there, and it's like if one is not communicating with the other, it's that's where the letdowns can happen.
Speaker 1:And so not only that, but like you are losing potential revenue by not having these two groups and departments working together, conversing, collaborating closely, right, because then all of a sudden you over-promised and under-delivered, you know. And that can go the other way around too, cause, like I've worked at places and agencies where it's like we had a sales team and they were going out to close deals and projects and they would lean really hard in with some clients and get a little creative on stuff, and then they would come to us and be like now we have to deliver on all this. And so then I just started saying, okay, listen, we're going to like, do like a weekly meeting together. I would love to be on your like. Maybe second call with a potential leader client if you're comfortable with it, and they were more than happy because they're like, bring it, if I can bring somebody that's in the business doing the work to this potential client, they're going to be like oh my God, you're already making me a priority, so it's really just a win-win.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, and what it does is also informs how you put together. It gives the entirety of the company the opportunity to hear what clients really want through the noise of. I also want to be special, so one of the things that I find specifically in the marketing space is that y'all have an entire like does everybody know? Like Brazilian steakhouses and how they have salad bars that have 99 different things, because you can have an all-you-can-eat salad bar at the steak joint. So y'all's offerings are kind of like that I want, and I can go up over and over and over again and get different combinations of things. One of the biggest challenges that I challenge everyone with is thinking about the most common denominators and making it as simple as possible for your salespeople to sell or for yourselves to sell right, Because the more you can come to commonality, the more efficient your sales life cycle is. Everything else outside of it can be an upsell or a continuation of the relationship.
Speaker 2:That's a great point, and when we're looking at our clients, how many of us would say that our clients know what they need?
Speaker 1:Yeah, nobody's raising their hand. I can't see any of them, but I know they're not raising their hands.
Speaker 2:They're all going, katie. You know that's not true. You know we have to educate them about the appropriate way to do everything. If I use me as an example, I've now been sales. Uprising will be nine this year and I still couldn't tell you what I know from a marketing perspective, like it's horrible, it is, it's hard, you don't.
Speaker 1:And then my favorite client was the one and I let her go right after that. This was actually like not even straight. I was pretty much straight out of college.
Speaker 2:I'll know what I want when I see it, I was like no ma'am, no ma'am, no ma'am.
Speaker 2:We cannot afford to do that, right. Thank you very much for letting me know. You know what. I've got another call. Yeah, goodbye, oh, I'm late for a meeting. Definitely reach back out to me, right, yeah, cool, never, yeah. And even as a business owner, even I feel bad when people are like so Katie, what do you? Even the most simple things, I don't. I don't find myself online very much, so when people ask like so what are some websites that you would love your website to be the vibe of, I'm like you're joking, right?
Speaker 1:I don't have any idea, what that means.
Speaker 2:I don't know why don't you show me the three sexiest templates of a website and I can tell you what the most value is? I mean for me to have to go look at the entirety of the internet to figure out what my vibe is in terms of website. When I know nothing is a big ask.
Speaker 1:And that's why I think to this whole kind of mindset shift of sales before marketing is that then you can start to see like why are customers coming, why are they buying? And then that's how you, in turn, just reverse engineer that and that's how you market it, versus trying to overcomplicate it because it can be challenging and expensive. But like yeah, it's so funny, you and Danelle, if you guys haven't connected already, you need to. She was like when you said how many of your clients know what they want? And like I said nobody's raising their to. She was like when you said how many of your clients know what they want?
Speaker 2:And like I said nobody's raising their hand, she's like, oh my God, zero. And then parentheses sobs into her coffee. It's okay, girl, I feel you and I'll be in Denver in November hey there we go.
Speaker 1:I love it, I love it.
Speaker 2:So honestly right, it really is true. So how many of you see, there you go. I love it when marketing is like, yeah, katie, so it's a month to month, like people can come on board. Now I know of no one in marketing who's like, yep, you see ROI in the first 30 days? Yeah, because marketing's function, the function of marketing, doesn't even work that way. The function of sales doesn't work that way, depending on the price of your offering and the heft of the service that you offer. Right, if you're selling an online course, pish tosh, right, like great For an online course at X amount of dollars, you just need to make sure that you're the loudest person on the mountain and getting the most looks. And, whatever the case is, that's not the heart of any of our business, and to create that one course that speaks to those people takes time. If you don't really know what your people need, why are we putting a digital course on? We would call it throwing spaghetti at the wall to see what sticks right Absolutely, which is time consuming and expensive.
Speaker 2:I'm sorry, can you say that louder please? Time consuming and expensive. I'm sorry, can you?
Speaker 1:say that louder please. Time consuming and expensive Right.
Speaker 2:So my company is based on basically squeezing all the juice out of every penny you have to invest in your business, and when you're brand new, you've already spent money to get your business license, maybe get a domain name, print business cards or even get a digital card kind of app. You know like these things, and so I need you to make a deal as fast as possible, because it isn't until that sale happens that the wheels really start to click in like watch gears right, so they go together with things, versus crafting entire marketing plans out of thin air or just because you think so.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, no, exactly, this is so great, oh, my goodness. All right, you have to say that cashflow is the oxygen of your business. Could you expand a little on that metaphor and share some examples of how prioritizing sales can transform a client's business?
Speaker 2:Absolutely. I did a YouTube series. We all did weird things during the pandemic, right? So I went into a studio a couple of times and put together these tidbits and the series was called Feed the Fire, and fire in our business is cash flow, and oxygen is what feeds fire, and cash flow is what keeps our business alive.
Speaker 2:So this is the theory. You know, this is the side of that's where all of that came from. So, if you can, if everybody can like, close their eyes and think about their companies as a plane like their businesses, as a plane like their biggest visions, for what they want through their own entrepreneurial capability. It ends up becoming a pretty big plane, like an Airbus 320 or something like that. And what planes need in an effort to take off is runway, and the bigger the plane, the bigger the runway. Cash in your business elongates your runway.
Speaker 2:Anything you do that either is an expense, which, let's be clear, marketing is an expense, nothing wrong with it. But every expense hacks at your runway, in terms of both cash and time and like bandwidth, right, right. It doesn't matter if you're the CEO of a 5,000 person company or if you are you as a CEO getting her done. That's just the universal truth. So cash is what we need. More Cash is queen. It needs to be the focus, because the majority of small business owners don't start. They're bootstrap girl, let's be honest who has bootstrap?
Speaker 2:Woo, woo, love me some boots, especially if they have straps. So you know, I've been a business owner three times. There was only one of those times when I really thought about what that would mean. It took me being a business owner two times over to really understand what that would mean to my quote, unquote back office and by that I mean my house in terms of, like, what does it look like when you don't get a regular check to pay rent or mortgage or your bills or whatever?
Speaker 2:You never really know, yeah, and we have a tendency when we're new in business where every dollar we spend goes back into the business and we tell ourselves really fascinating and false paradigms like you have to spend money to make money and it's compounding. So everything about all of that points to we need to make more money faster instead of taking our time to get it right. How many businesses do you know that literally never went anywhere because they took too long trying to figure it out, and what that really means like behind closed doors is that they waited until they were too broke and too burnt out to ever even try and really sell. It's heartbreaking.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I can imagine. Yeah, it does seem really common and it's one of those things. It's a piece of advice I got early on when I came into entrepreneurship and that was like the majority of your activities in time should be revenue generating activities. Boom, it is the thing that, like it's just, I don't know why. Usually it's because we are good at the other things that we might do and bring to the table, and when you're an entrepreneur, you're like I'm my own boss, I'm going to do what I want.
Speaker 2:All right, you know, and there's always that like Ooh, katie, I'm so excited I got to fire my first client. Like this is like this bar of like. Now I know I'm really in business because I got to not work with someone who I would normally have had to have worked with.
Speaker 2:Yes, right, um, I, it's a, it's a revenue generating activities. So I guess this is the other thing. So, context you and I talked about how there's the context of a thing there is a marketing pipeline and there is a sales pipeline. So for anybody on the pot who's listening to the podcast, that's like yeah, katie, so I don't understand where the these two rivers meet. Like, how does this look? What does this look like?
Speaker 2:If you picture a traditional funnel and all of the activities that marketing do, that funnel sits directly on top of a sales funnel. Where they meet is at prospects, right, and so there is this handoff. There has to be this handshake, yes, and it really is best when reverse engineered. So if you start all the way at the bottom of a sales funnel with the little dollar that dripped out, right, which is a client, and then you deliver to that client and then you reverse engineer, what did it look like when I presented? What did it look like when I asked them for their business?
Speaker 2:And you go up a level and say what did it look like when I presented them with my option? Yeah, what did it look like when I presented? What did it look like when I asked them for their business. And you go up a level and say, what did it look like when I presented them with my option? What did it look like when I qualified them even further, where did I get them as potential? And then all of the steps of a marketing funnel upwards. That is how we can. If we focus on the dollar first, that's how we create businesses that are cashflow heavy. As long as that's the focus Right, Because that dollar informs every other piece, yeah, that's how you follow the money, folks.
Speaker 1:I mean I'm sitting here doodling, I'm like drawing your little funnels. I'm like I'm so excited you and I were going to sit down and we're just going to play around with more of this stuff. But yeah, I think it's. It is. It's just a different mindset and way to think about things, Cause we just get all of this stuff pounded into our head over and over and over again and, like I said, most of our listeners are on the side of marketing, and so what are some other ways that they could better align their strategies to sales objectives? I mean, that example you just gave was great, but do you have any other thoughts?
Speaker 2:Well, one. I'm going to challenge all of you to like a 30-day money focus. I like that. It's not really what I can tell you, because each one of you are you. You come with your own special sauce. I haven't met all of you yet. Give it a minute I will.
Speaker 2:But you know, we'll solve that I haven't met all of you yet.
Speaker 2:Give it a minute I will, but you know we'll solve that. The truth of the matter is if, if you did nothing else, if you promised yourself, like you all know how to schedule your push out for posting and content, ladies, gentlemen, you know that you have all the content you need for like the next five years. So quit saying you need to up your content game. What a bunch of hooey. So if you could set your marketing and forget it for 30 days, if you could say Katie, right now, I promise I will close my eyes to my business's marketing and I will only focus on generating cash for the next 30 days, I guarantee you you will be closer to your goals, your revenue goals, your business dreams, than you are right now or will ever be. If you don't do that, as a matter of fact, oh look, amy, I'm going to give you homework after 30 days. So on April 7th, 30 days from now, whenever you're listening to this, I want you to get in touch with Amy.
Speaker 1:And I want you to report if you made.
Speaker 2:Put it in the right. If you're in the community, put it in the Slack channel. How much money have you made? I love it. Yeah, let's do it.
Speaker 1:Why wouldn't we Like? Because then it begins to like, beg that question of like, really analyzing for your business, what are your most revenue generating activities? Right, and you have to maybe do a little bit of thinking and digging again, based on your product, based on your service, whatever that might be, because sometimes I don't think a lot of folks even know what that is. And again, as a business owner, we are sort of preconditioned or just have preferences on the types of activities that we prefer.
Speaker 1:because it's comfortable, right, but it might not be the thing that's generating the money, that we need to keep the money, the mission, whatever it may be going. And so trying to figure that out I think sometimes for folks is scary. When you say pause your marketing, I'm like oh god, like things happen in my body.
Speaker 2:And I don't mean pause your marketing, really, you guys just set it for 30 days, yeah well, yeah, just go set like, set it and forget it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you all are the brilliant minds behind marketing. You know how to do that, what it's going to look like. I would put forward that you probably have your plan for at least for three months, right? So why is it something that we pay so much attention to that takes up so much of our very, very expensive time to play around with? Like, trust yourself in your own expertise and go focus on a different hat in your business. Go be the CEO and the number one salesperson and see what that actually where that can take you. Yeah, it can't hurt. Yeah, I mean, I promise it can't.
Speaker 1:Right, yeah, 30 days. I love it, all right. Well, I'll have to check back in Jeez Homework for my own, so that's a first, but I'll take it. I don't take it. I love it. I like a good challenge, it's all good. We need that. That's why we need each other and communicate our conversations like this and community, because otherwise I think, especially as an entrepreneur, it is really easy to kind of get stuck in a bit of a rut and routine because you're like this is what this is, this routine, because you're like this is working well enough.
Speaker 2:But is it enough? Is it enough? The answer is probably, but we'll never feel like it. And the craziest thing about entrepreneurship, the thing nobody ever told me and again, I had owned two businesses. Of course I had co-founders or co-owners, but it's a lonely joint. We spend a lot of time on our own hamster wheel trying to answer questions that maybe nobody ever asked and we don't even really think like why is this the question? Why did I think this was the thing? And then we get stuck down that rabbit hole. I mean, there are so many scary, scary rabbit holes and it's such a big, long field with so many hidden booby traps that we can, you know, not look up for two weeks to see what's going on. Maybe we got stuck in delivery, right? So the thing we really love, the reason why we do this, you know, we just we just paid attention to our clients for two weeks and then we look up and we're like, oh, this well's dry, yeah, no exactly.
Speaker 1:What am I doing Right? No, I definitely. I know a lot of our listeners probably feel that as well. I was kind of curious too if there was ever an instance in kind of building and scaling through businesses, if there was ever really a marketing initiative that hindered sales, and if so, what did you learn from it?
Speaker 2:Oh, a marketing. So a marketing effort that hindered sales. I'd have to go back and look to see if, ultimately, the marketing has paid off. But for me what that looks like is getting too lost in the marketing to have a sales effort. That's really what it always comes.
Speaker 2:I literally have to outsource all of that, Otherwise I will be the proverbial person staring online to see if I got likes and clicks and scrolling and seeing if people subscribed or unsubscribed I mean it gets to which. Let's be clear, none of that is the point. What I care about is hey, is my calendar filled with juicy sales calls? But when you are so close as an entrepreneur, so close to the marketing, you're very much like Sally Field. You just want everybody to like you, right. So I have absolutely gotten caught up in that and, like from some bad trip or dream, like woken up, going wait what? I don't know that I care about any of that. I only care about the people who heard it and get it and want it, not all the other people. So for me it's very easy to lose the thread of the purpose of marketing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because it's huge. Marketing is a huge umbrella. Sales is sales. Sales is like the simplest of the things. I hate to tell you this, you guys, but the reason why you want to care about sales is because it's so much simpler than marketing. Marketing is this like umbrella that has all of these spokes and they're each their own thing, right. So PR, branding, digital, and then even digital has its own little baby spokes. That would just make for a funny looking umbrella just for a funny looking umbrella.
Speaker 2:But you know, in person marketing it's wide, it's huge, it's varying, it's massive and so it's easy for me, and probably every single one of your clients, to like get stuck in that and and forget the revenue generation portion of pulling someone from the top of your marketing funnel all the way through to the dollar.
Speaker 1:Right, right, right. Yeah, I totally get it, and it's kind of hard to sometimes always put thoughts in words too, because it's like you keep seeing it time and time again. But it's out there and it's happening. And I feel like we've actually touched on it in the podcast a couple of times before where it's like we become so in love with the idea of what we're selling versus the actual sale, right, and then we kind of get into our own little way of. I'm trying to think of what it was.
Speaker 1:Gosh, I literally was having a call this morning with Bridget Bridget. What did I say? She's probably not listening right now. I think she had a client call, but we were talking about oh, so my husband works for an AI company and they were trying to create AI agents where you could actually not just talk to and create people, but you could actually talk to a product. And he was like can you ever think he's an academic and programmer? So he's like you know he's listened and learned a lot by being around me for 20 plus years about marketing. But he asked me, he dared to ask me would a person ever want to talk to a product? And I said that sounds like a marketer's wet dream.
Speaker 2:I was going to say oh my gosh, I feel like when you talk about marketers' heads exploding, they're like you're going to get blown up with. Hey, amy, does he want to do any like beta? I'm happy to talk to him.
Speaker 1:Yes, they do, but it's like that's the thing, though. It's like you know what, unless you are truly solving a problem for a customer so, say, I need to put together a piece of furniture, yeah. If you want to have a bot or an agent that will talk me verbally through so I don't have to keep reading the directions or instructions or something like that, then yeah, but make it useful. But I would I want to talk to just a bottle of ketchup. Hells, no, Like I have more things to do with my life right now. I'm just I'm just now worrying do I need ketchup, Cause I'm pretty sure we're getting low, so maybe I need to order some like that's. That's the reality.
Speaker 2:So I think that's me. I'm like do you need ketchup? What would it look like if you had no? Ketchup is sugary, you know, grow your own tomatoes, squish them, I don't know.
Speaker 1:I don't know. I have to make a lot more sales before I have that kind of, before I can buy that kind of time, Katie. But that's what I mean, though, is, I think sometimes, by marketing it's like you know we get so excited, and, again, I am a former creative director and will always be a creative director deep down in my core, and so, yes, love brilliant, big, conceptual ideas, but at the end of the day like again, at the end of the day, are they creating the sales? Are you solving the problems that are truly out there in the world that are happening for people? And if you aren't focusing, like you're saying, on that sales and putting that first and then reverse engineering, then you're kind of just making a bunch of stuff that really ain't opening Cause.
Speaker 1:You're just kind of adding to the proverbial garbage of the advertising universe, you know which. Honestly, the end of the day, too let's. I mean I don't mean to go like totally down a rabbit hole here and get on my soapbox too much, going in two directions at once. I'm sorry for all my ADD friends that are riding along this train with me, but you really are like you are adding to there's carbon footprint, to the stuff that we put out there right Is advertisers. So it's like, if I can even if you can't take anything else from this too like maybe just think about it from that perspective, right. Like you're not just doing a good thing for your potential customers and clients and business by focusing on sales first and then reverse engineering your marketing. Clients in business. By focusing on sales first and then reverse engineering your marketing, you're also saving money time planet.
Speaker 2:I mean, come on, it's a win, win, win. I completely agree with you on that. I had a friend who was in marketing. She was the first person who said to me content is spam, yeah, and um, I mean, we would arm wrestle about that concept and to some extent, it can be true. Marketers my favorite thing about them is that their brain is constantly working towards solving the riddle of how can you say this differently for this target market, so that they can hear this message which I love about marketers? I would also put forward that somehow and this is a mistake that I made and I have to be very intentional in thinking about it Sales is a very creative function for your business.
Speaker 2:If you close your eyes and you think about your top 10 clients, I would bet that they weren't all sold in the same way, because humans be different. So don't forget that your creativity can be utilized in your sales function as well. For the longest time, I just thought you know what Sales is like, the most mathematical of the thing you get, because you hear it all the time Like for, even if you're bad at sales, you'll close 10% of the deals. Now, that's absolutely true. If you're a huge corporation, you're on a regular cold calling track, all of these things. If you're a business owner who only wants to talk to qualified people who are potentially interested in your services, it's going to look vastly different, different and so just don't forget that you don't have to take the creativity out of who you are in an effort to spell Absolutely.
Speaker 2:When I told my people on a stage once that, like I always thought I was the least creative person ever, I wasn't the person in my house who like embroidered stuff or stamped cards or was our quote unquote, artistic at all I got so much pushback and what my people said is Katie, you like the words that you use just to make things available to people and the different types of perspectives that you put forward is vastly creative and I really had to think about it all differently. So I would challenge everybody who thinks that sales is like such a dry thing. You have the capability to be as creative as you want in your sale.
Speaker 1:And I was going to say I oftentimes think that it's funny, I think after a while too, once you know your product or your service inside and out and you truly do believe in it, like you are selling and you don't even realize that you're selling and that's to be like the best kind of selling right.
Speaker 1:So I'm kind of wondering, with that and the homework that I have. You say every business action is a sales conversation. So with this kind of perspective shift like, how can businesses, business owners like myself, implement this mindset in their day to day operations?
Speaker 2:owners like myself, implement this mindset in their day-to-day operations. Four I'll give it to you guys easy because it can start from a marketing place. So every conversation you have, whether it's online, in person heaven forbid it be on the phone.
Speaker 1:Wait, what those things that you can talk through those?
Speaker 2:Yes, I love it Just to hear someone's voice. Imagine not being for those of us that may have more neurodivergence than others. If we could just listen to a voice, how could that help us? So all of that, how you present yourself, is your marketing, is your in-person marketing. And so, even without quote, unquote, being pushy, you guys have no idea how hard that is for me to say but, I know that some of you all feel that way or being salesy not a real word.
Speaker 2:Try to look it up. If you are just being you, this is what I mean by every conversation is a business transaction. Just by you and I having this conversation and educating people, or literally just enjoying each other's company and having a great conversation about things that you and I love. It has the ability to turn into business, yeah Right, and you never know where that's going to be. So be that all the time. You love your stuff. You're the expert at this thing. You know you help people yeah, so just embody that everywhere you go.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, love it. I agree, I agree, I think that's where it's gotten easier for me over the years. It's like I just kind of get into my zone and then I'm like, oh, didn't realize I was selling it. I agree, I agree, I think that's where it's gotten easier for me over the years is like I just kind of get into my zone and then I'm like, oh, didn't realize I was selling it, didn't realize I was like I'm just gushing because I like what I do and I believe in our mission and our members and our community, because I've seen directly, having gone from member to business owner of the organization that I was a very member of, that like this can be a life-changing experience and opportunity and it doesn't feel like a sale at all.
Speaker 2:It's just the damn truth, people at the end of the day as long. So I think you know, oh, the truth, we don't have a whole lot of time and we're not interested in getting into, like the world at large right, but we need 10 more hours, right.
Speaker 1:I'll call you later with a cocktail girl.
Speaker 2:Let's do it you know, um, we get to decide who we are like. There are words that we use to describe ourselves, and I would bet with 99.9 certainty that the majority of your membership and listeners to your podcast are integral people, meaning that they're very, very honest people. So you don't have to worry, you don't have to fret, you don't have to put a whole lot of time and energy into being something you're not. And if we're talking about creating longer runways, how great is that Truth as an efficiency in business? Imagine that. You know it's the best. The reason why it works for you to sell that way is because it is true. Therefore, it rings true. I'm sure there's like a neuropsychological reason why truth rings. Is it a saying? I'm sure we could look that up Now. I really want to look that up. See, it's not just you.
Speaker 2:But it also it is one of the things that your buyers want. Whoever you are, whatever your target market is, your buyer wants to believe you. So if you're just telling the truth, you never have to worry about it. It can be the easiest thing. Yeah, yeah, this is what it looks like and you don't have to be concerned about it. You've done all of the amazing marketing work. You've got potential people who want to pay you in your pipeline right now, so just go be honest with them. Yeah, I took a look at your website. You've got X, y and Z going on. Girl, it's no bueno, you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, do a favor. I love it All right, there's a statistic that you cite that 90% of businesses don't reach their sales goals. It's pretty staggering. What are some of the reasons why you feel like this is such a statistic?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think. The last time I looked it up it was like 98% of solopreneurs don't hit 100K. And the reason for that is everything that we've already mentioned. Their focus and intention is elsewhere.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Instead of choosing very purposefully to go figure out how much the people they think they help will pay them to do that very thing. If you focus on anything else first, every time you do that you're putting a boulder in front of your success, and so when we do that too much, the mountain becomes too high to climb. We can't overcome it. Every single person who runs a business understands that, in addition to choosing to be a business owner, you have the ability to decide whether or not you want to be a CEO, a founder, a president like just the title of what you are, and regardless of what you call it, it's a whole thing. Just like the title of mom or partner, or like those are also whole things when you're an employee versus a business owner. Those two holes aren't equal.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, that's true.
Speaker 2:Being an entrepreneur requires more of you than anything. You and I talked about this right and I said, oh, it's such a controversial statement. Parents don't like it when I say this, but being an entrepreneur requires more of you than even being a parent, like in the confines of your own home. Your kids don't expect you to be perfect, your clients kind of do Right. So there is so much pressure on us to get it right and I think the majority of us never make it because we don't focus on the right thing.
Speaker 2:If we are looking for our businesses to be successful meaning our business pays for itself and it pays us, yeah, right, and I mean it pays us a salary, and I mean it pays us a livable salary and if we're lucky, because what we're looking to create, it won't just give us a livable salary. It will also do things like pay for our insurance, like businesses should, or like the company we would want to work for would, right. It pays us for our paid vacation time. It pays into our retirement and our long-term health insurance. It helps pay for kids' college or whatever. That is you guys. But when we stop focusing on that, we get further and further away from it and so many people crash and burn to like just burnout lack of funds. They can't go any further.
Speaker 1:Right, right, right. Or just building that mountain of debt, which is also another slippery slope for a lot of small businesses out there. Yeah, and I mean on that note with you know, as a small business or solopreneur with limited resources, you know, obviously we're saying I feel like the question answers, we've answered it. I don't know why I put this one so far down, focusing on building a sales process first or our content marketing first. So, instead of asking that obvious question, I'm going to say where do we start in evaluating and building our sales process as entrepreneurs or small business owners?
Speaker 2:Don't worry about it being a process depending on how big a company you start right away, like if you're a bootstrap scenario and it's you, if you're the solopreneur, don't worry about the word process. Gosh, that sounds so complicated for what it is. Just go sell your thing. Go sell your thing and if it doesn't hit your market, look at two things Is it what I'm offering it or is it the market? Yep, yep. And then go from there and then try to sell the thing again, either in a different way or to a different market, and see what you get.
Speaker 1:Yes, I really like that, and I think focusing on both offer and market are really critical. So I actually want to dig in a little bit deeper on that. I think that we're getting so close to time. Where did the time go? But, like, offer is so paramount and market is also so paramount, and by market again, we're not talking marketing, we're talking about who you are talking to. Maybe give us like two good pieces of advice on both making sure that we're you know we were doing the right kinds of offers and that we are looking at the right market.
Speaker 2:Okay. So it will start with your expertise, right? So let's start with your offer first, because it's the easiest to understand. You come with some sexy stuff. You come with some sexy stuff. You come with some sexy stuff, uh. So you're going to move forward in that vein. You already you started a business because of that very thing. So start with that. Start with what you think is your sexiest, juiciest like everybody's going to want to eat it up with a spoon. You think in your mind it's the easiest thing on earth to understand. So start with that as your offer.
Speaker 2:Now you're going to pick a market, you're going to pick a niche is what amy's talking about in a different way to say it, since we're marketing versus market. Um, you will know if you have it right after 90 days. If you are highly focused on your niche for 90 days and you don't get anything, it's the wrong niche and that's okay. You will have so much data about why that's the wrong niche. You'll have language that will point you to the right direction. So it is okay. If you are adding a niche or if you are subtracting a niche and going in a different direction, do it sooner rather than later. I think would be in an effort to stay in time. That's what I would give people.
Speaker 1:I think that's great advice. Yeah, and definitely looking at your market. Can they afford what you're selling? Are they truly your market or not? I think that's sometimes hard to acknowledge and realize.
Speaker 2:Or you may just not know. So ask. Don't forget when you're talking to your people ask for budget. I know you guys, I know I just heard every single one of you cringe, knock it off. Let me put it to you a different way. Do you like getting super excited about something and then hearing the price and having your heart fall and be like, oh, I love you, but that's just not me right now. Why would you want to do that to your people? So just ask them. So you're looking to have a website built. Can I ask what you think you were looking to pay for that? Do you know what your budget should be? It's a great opportunity to educate them on what that should look like, based on what their goals are, and it gives you an idea of like oh wow, people really don't know, or this market isn't the right niche for me.
Speaker 1:Exactly, yeah, 100%. All right, live listeners. You've got the chance here to ask a question, if you've got one of Katie, but we appreciate all your engagement and comments in the chat while we've been chatting here ourselves. Katie, we've got like a minute left, so I'm just going to ask you my favorite question that we had for you in the Power Round question today, and that was what is your go-to response when a prospect says I need to think about it.
Speaker 2:Great. What do you need to think about? I love that. I love it. You know, you guys, at the end of the day, sales is a conversation. I know people will say sales is education, sales is a solution, sales is all these things. But really you're talking to somebody. So if somebody said I need to think about that, my question one, they should never ask that because at the end of your presentation you will say is there any other question that you have for me that I can answer? That will let you know I'm the right company for you. So ultimately they should never ask that. You get ahead of that question. But if you have forgotten to ask that question, they say I just need to think about it. I love that for you. What exactly do you need to think about? What questions do you have that I can answer? What's your timeline on that? How long are you willing to have this be a problem or a challenge?
Speaker 2:for you before you're ready to take care of it.
Speaker 1:I love that one. That's a good one right there. That's money Because, yeah, they're just sitting there Again. If you have the right audience, the right market and you have the right offer, that it feels like stupid to refuse, right? And then they still have this. Oh, that last question, that's perfect, I love it. I'm going to have to play that one back a couple times.
Speaker 2:They're good. And, ladies and gents, add it earlier when you're qualifying your people, before you ever present the amazingness of you ask them all these things up front.
Speaker 1:How? The amazingness of you Ask them all these things up front. How long, yeah, how long are you willing to let this continue to be an issue? How much longer do you want this to keep you up at night? Because I can just solve it for you right now.
Speaker 2:The sale doesn't happen when you ask them the question about whether or not they want to do business. It happens way before that. So we should never leave any opportunity for a question like that to be at the end.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's fantastic. Well, on that phenomenal advice, we'll go ahead and wrap it. Don't worry, my friends and numbers Katie is in our Slack, so if you all want to ask her more questions, you can feel free to jump into Slack, maybe get some time with her. I also dropped the links to her website and YouTube channel into the chat, so make sure you grab those before we hop off. Katie, thank you so much for sharing all of your expertise and insights with our community and energy Just love it. Your perspective on prioritizing sales and the importance of cash flow as business oxygen is, I hope, going to help save and keep a lot of good businesses going, because we've got a lot of awesome business owners here within our group. So, basically, make sure that you all connect with Katie on LinkedIn or on our Slack and to our Power Lounge community. Thank you so much for joining us today. If you enjoyed this conversation, please share it with a colleague or someone who else might benefit from the insights. Remember that at Together Digital, we believe in sharing our knowledge, power and connections, and to learn more about the community upcoming events, again, check out our website togetherindigitalcom.
Speaker 1:Until next week. Everyone keep asking oh, no, wait. Keep giving and keep growing. Not next week. We are taking a two-week break. Y'all, it's spring break. I'm going to be in Austin for South by next week and then in the mountains with my kiddos the week after. So please go back and check out some of our past episodes. We have got three amazing seasons of wonderful, amazing, powerful women, such as Katie, for you to listen and learn and grow from. So, yeah, we'll see you all at the end of March. Everyone take care till then. Bye.
Speaker 2:Produced by Heartcast Media.
